Discussion:
NSTextView 2
(too old to reply)
Robert Cerny
2000-06-07 14:50:29 UTC
Permalink
Hi,
I have got a problem with NSTextView. I need to get a message every time
user write a char into it. Should I subclass NSTextView or is there any
other simpler way?
--
Robert Cerny
**************************
Robert Cerny
DataLine Technology Ltd.
Ceskomoravska 15
190 00 Prague 9
Czech Republic
mailto:***@dlt.cz
http://www.dlt.cz
ICQ: 24277867
PGP public keyID: 0x869BE348
Mark F. Murphy
2000-06-07 15:11:41 UTC
Permalink
I sent email to "***@seeding.apple.com" asking if there was a
list to discuess DP4 issues where one would not violate their seeding
license.

So far, no response.

Do I not have the correct email address?

In fact, I didn't see any email lists on the ADC member site.

mark
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark F. Murphy, Director Software Development <mailto:***@tyrell.com>
Tyrell Software Corp <http://www.tyrell.com>
PowerPerl(tm), Add Power To Your Webpage! <http://www.powerperl.com>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Families Against Internet Censorship: http://home.rmi.net/~fagin/faic/
David Young
2000-06-07 16:49:05 UTC
Permalink
This is off topic, but I know a lot of language lovers live here...

what is the := operator symbol typically used for?

Does someone know of a general comp. language mail list I can subscribe to?

Thanks A Bunch! David Young; VVI-DCS
***@vvi.com
David Young
2000-06-07 16:49:05 UTC
Permalink
This is off topic, but I know a lot of language lovers live here...

what is the := operator symbol typically used for?

Does someone know of a general comp. language mail list I can subscribe to?

Thanks A Bunch! David Young; VVI-DCS
***@vvi.com
Wade Williams
2000-06-07 19:46:47 UTC
Permalink
I got a reply back from ADC. No such lists exist.

Wade

-----Original Message-----
From: macosx-***@omnigroup.com [mailto:macosx-***@omnigroup.com]On
Behalf Of Mark F. Murphy
Sent: Wednesday, June 07, 2000 11:11 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list
Subject: List To Discuss DP4 Issues



I sent email to "***@seeding.apple.com" asking if there was a
list to discuess DP4 issues where one would not violate their seeding
license.

So far, no response.

Do I not have the correct email address?

In fact, I didn't see any email lists on the ADC member site.

mark
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark F. Murphy, Director Software Development <mailto:***@tyrell.com>
Tyrell Software Corp <http://www.tyrell.com>
PowerPerl(tm), Add Power To Your Webpage! <http://www.powerperl.com>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Families Against Internet Censorship: http://home.rmi.net/~fagin/faic/
Scott Anguish
2000-06-08 01:21:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wade Williams
I got a reply back from ADC. No such lists exist.
Discussing the Cocoa and Carbon APIs publically is allowed, since this
information is available publically on Apple's WWW site.

The current embargoes are on screenshots, GUI issues that haven't been
shown in public, and performance.

Or so I've been told with respect to coverage on Stepwise.
--
Scott Anguish
Stepwise - http://www.stepwise.com
Jason M. Smith
2000-06-08 03:30:40 UTC
Permalink
Okay, I'm confused. (And easily confusable...)

I want to install DP4 over DP3 on my development machine.
Relevant partitions are laid out as:

1) MacOS 8.6 (soon to be bumped to 9) (HFS+)
2) DP3 (HFS+)

Docs indicate that I should format the disk with DP3 to
install DP4, and tells how to go about doing that. Fine enough, I
did that on another machine already (yes, two licenses, thanks... :)
). That one was DP3 only, however.

So, question is: does the reformat performed blow away the
*entire* disk, or *just* the partition selected? You'd think the
latter, but I've seen enough gotchas lately to make me question it.
Yeah, yeah, "thou shalt back up before installing new software..."
This is Just To Make Sure(tm).

Horror stories?

Green lights?
--
Jason Smith 037 Sitterson Hall
***@cs.unc.edu (919) 962-1821
------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.cs.unc.edu/~smithja/
Mark F. Murphy
2000-06-08 19:02:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scott Anguish
Post by Wade Williams
I got a reply back from ADC. No such lists exist.
Discussing the Cocoa and Carbon APIs publically is allowed, since this
information is available publically on Apple's WWW site.
The current embargoes are on screenshots, GUI issues that haven't been
shown in public, and performance.
What about issues of stuff not working? Or where and how to fund
things in DP4?

mark
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark F. Murphy, Director Software Development <mailto:***@tyrell.com>
Tyrell Software Corp <http://www.tyrell.com>
PowerPerl(tm), Add Power To Your Webpage! <http://www.powerperl.com>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Families Against Internet Censorship: http://home.rmi.net/~fagin/faic/
Jason M. Smith
2000-06-08 03:30:40 UTC
Permalink
Okay, I'm confused. (And easily confusable...)

I want to install DP4 over DP3 on my development machine.
Relevant partitions are laid out as:

1) MacOS 8.6 (soon to be bumped to 9) (HFS+)
2) DP3 (HFS+)

Docs indicate that I should format the disk with DP3 to
install DP4, and tells how to go about doing that. Fine enough, I
did that on another machine already (yes, two licenses, thanks... :)
). That one was DP3 only, however.

So, question is: does the reformat performed blow away the
*entire* disk, or *just* the partition selected? You'd think the
latter, but I've seen enough gotchas lately to make me question it.
Yeah, yeah, "thou shalt back up before installing new software..."
This is Just To Make Sure(tm).

Horror stories?

Green lights?
--
Jason Smith 037 Sitterson Hall
***@cs.unc.edu (919) 962-1821
------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.cs.unc.edu/~smithja/
Mark F. Murphy
2000-06-08 19:02:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scott Anguish
Post by Wade Williams
I got a reply back from ADC. No such lists exist.
Discussing the Cocoa and Carbon APIs publically is allowed, since this
information is available publically on Apple's WWW site.
The current embargoes are on screenshots, GUI issues that haven't been
shown in public, and performance.
What about issues of stuff not working? Or where and how to fund
things in DP4?

mark
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark F. Murphy, Director Software Development <mailto:***@tyrell.com>
Tyrell Software Corp <http://www.tyrell.com>
PowerPerl(tm), Add Power To Your Webpage! <http://www.powerperl.com>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Families Against Internet Censorship: http://home.rmi.net/~fagin/faic/
Mark F. Murphy
2000-06-08 18:54:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wade Williams
I got a reply back from ADC. No such lists exist.
Hmmmm... sounds like there needs to be an *underground* list where
the list owners do not care DP4 is being discussed and where posters
are anonymous to Apple doesn't go after their seeding license.

Not being able to talk about DP4 issues with fellow developers is not fun.

mark
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark F. Murphy, Director Software Development <mailto:***@tyrell.com>
Tyrell Software Corp <http://www.tyrell.com>
PowerPerl(tm), Add Power To Your Webpage! <http://www.powerperl.com>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Families Against Internet Censorship: http://home.rmi.net/~fagin/faic/
Scott Anguish
2000-06-08 01:21:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wade Williams
I got a reply back from ADC. No such lists exist.
Discussing the Cocoa and Carbon APIs publically is allowed, since this
information is available publically on Apple's WWW site.

The current embargoes are on screenshots, GUI issues that haven't been
shown in public, and performance.

Or so I've been told with respect to coverage on Stepwise.
--
Scott Anguish
Stepwise - http://www.stepwise.com
Mark F. Murphy
2000-06-08 18:54:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wade Williams
I got a reply back from ADC. No such lists exist.
Hmmmm... sounds like there needs to be an *underground* list where
the list owners do not care DP4 is being discussed and where posters
are anonymous to Apple doesn't go after their seeding license.

Not being able to talk about DP4 issues with fellow developers is not fun.

mark
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark F. Murphy, Director Software Development <mailto:***@tyrell.com>
Tyrell Software Corp <http://www.tyrell.com>
PowerPerl(tm), Add Power To Your Webpage! <http://www.powerperl.com>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Families Against Internet Censorship: http://home.rmi.net/~fagin/faic/
Elliot Silver
2000-06-07 20:19:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Young
what is the := operator symbol typically used for?
I've generally (only?) seen it used for assignment.

If I recall correctly this is what Pascal (and from that I would assume
Modula and Oberon) uses, and Smalltalk also accepts it (Smalltalk originally
used left arrow for assignment and up arrow for return; at some point they
realised that these characters weren't always present so they also accept :=
and ^ for these items).


Elliot.
__________________________________________________________________
Elliot Silver, Software Developer ***@alitech.com
A.L.I. Technologies Inc. tel: (604) 279-5422 x376
130 - 10711 Cambie Road fax: (604) 279-5468
Richmond, BC, CANADA www.alitech.com
Peter Bierman
2000-06-08 04:10:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jason M. Smith
So, question is: does the reformat performed blow away the
*entire* disk, or *just* the partition selected? You'd think the
If you use Drive Setup, it does the whole disk.

If you use the DP4 installer, and check the "reformat" checkbox, then it
does just the volume you have selected.
Post by Jason M. Smith
Yeah, yeah, "thou shalt back up before installing new software..."
Almost every time someone's come to me and said "it nuked the wrong disk!",
it was because they picked the wrong disk themselves, and weren't paying
attention when the installer asked them if they really wanted to erase it.

Do that backup. It's a developer preview. It might eat your disks next
week, not just during installation. (And if it does, please let us know...)

-pmb

--
"Apple is doomed. At some point the universe may collapse upon itself, and
this would crush even the hard plastic shells of fast, high-capacity iMacs."
- Minneapolis Star Tribune 10.19.99
Eric Peyton
2000-06-08 20:42:42 UTC
Permalink
What issues can't you talk about here? Scott already mentioned that
development issues are a go as long as they are code based. This isn't
the right place to talk about the user interface of the operating
system. Basically if you can find a reference to it on the apple
public web pages it should be okay to discuss here (I beleive).

If you want to ask ... I was coding X on DP4 and Y happened, am I doing X
correct? - I would think that is very valid.

If you want to discuss things related to the OS UI, it doesn't belong here
anyway ...

What exactly can't people talk about on this development list that they
wish they could?

Eric


On Thu, 8 Jun
Post by Mark F. Murphy
Post by Wade Williams
I got a reply back from ADC. No such lists exist.
Hmmmm... sounds like there needs to be an *underground* list where
the list owners do not care DP4 is being discussed and where posters
are anonymous to Apple doesn't go after their seeding license.
Not being able to talk about DP4 issues with fellow developers is not fun.
mark
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tyrell Software Corp <http://www.tyrell.com>
PowerPerl(tm), Add Power To Your Webpage! <http://www.powerperl.com>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Families Against Internet Censorship: http://home.rmi.net/~fagin/faic/
Eric Peyton
***@epicware.com

Software and Source for Mac OS X
Mark F. Murphy
2000-06-08 21:27:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Eric Peyton
What exactly can't people talk about on this development list that they
wish they could?
For example, problems with DP4 and what others might have done to solve them.

mark
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark F. Murphy, Director Software Development <mailto:***@tyrell.com>
Tyrell Software Corp <http://www.tyrell.com>
PowerPerl(tm), Add Power To Your Webpage! <http://www.powerperl.com>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Families Against Internet Censorship: http://home.rmi.net/~fagin/faic/
Mark F. Murphy
2000-06-08 21:27:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Eric Peyton
What exactly can't people talk about on this development list that they
wish they could?
For example, problems with DP4 and what others might have done to solve them.

mark
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark F. Murphy, Director Software Development <mailto:***@tyrell.com>
Tyrell Software Corp <http://www.tyrell.com>
PowerPerl(tm), Add Power To Your Webpage! <http://www.powerperl.com>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Families Against Internet Censorship: http://home.rmi.net/~fagin/faic/
Marc De Scheemaecker
2000-06-08 22:14:43 UTC
Permalink
When installing Mac OS X DP3 over Mac OS X Server, I simply booted LinuxPPC
and used the pdisk utility.
I deleted the partitions (three of them) belonging to Mac OS X Server and
created a new HFS partition.
I booted then in Mac OS and used Silverlining Pro to reformat the partition
(for some reason, Special/Erase Disk didn't work) and I had a fresh
partition to install Mac OS X on.

PS: After you install Mac OS X, the partition becomes a little bit smaller
as two hidden partitions are created. One small HFS (type "Apple_Boot", name
"MOSX_OF3_Booter") that contains the OpenFirmware boot script and the first
stage boot loader.
A second partition(type "Apple_Loader", name "SecondaryLoader") contains the
second stage boot loader.
I guess if you simply "reuse" the MacOS X DP3 partition, you waste 8.5 MB
and two entries in the partition table.

PPS: - You can find information about the boot process on www.linuxppc.org.
- The process is pretty advanced, so don't blame me if something goes
wrong. Backups sometimes have their use ;-)
Post by Jason M. Smith
I want to install DP4 over DP3 on my development machine.
1) MacOS 8.6 (soon to be bumped to 9) (HFS+)
2) DP3 (HFS+)
Docs indicate that I should format the disk with DP3 to
install DP4, and tells how to go about doing that. Fine enough, I
did that on another machine already (yes, two licenses, thanks... :)
). That one was DP3 only, however.
Peter Bierman
2000-06-09 00:39:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marc De Scheemaecker
When installing Mac OS X DP3 over Mac OS X Server, I simply booted LinuxPPC
and used the pdisk utility.
I deleted the partitions (three of them) belonging to Mac OS X Server and
created a new HFS partition.
I booted then in Mac OS and used Silverlining Pro to reformat the partition
(for some reason, Special/Erase Disk didn't work) and I had a fresh
partition to install Mac OS X on.
That's definately the cleanest way to do it.
Post by Marc De Scheemaecker
I guess if you simply "reuse" the MacOS X DP3 partition, you waste 8.5 MB
and two entries in the partition table.
DP4 will reuse the DP3 booter and loader partitions if you install over
DP3, wasting nothing. :-)
Post by Marc De Scheemaecker
PS: After you install Mac OS X, the partition becomes a little bit smaller
as two hidden partitions are created. One small HFS (type "Apple_Boot", name
"MOSX_OF3_Booter") that contains the OpenFirmware boot script and the first
stage boot loader.
A second partition(type "Apple_Loader", name "SecondaryLoader") contains the
second stage boot loader.
Actually, the Booter is for NewWorld machines, and the Loader is for
OldWorld machines. And both partitions will eventually be unneeded for HFS+
installs.

-pmb

--
"Apple is doomed. At some point the universe may collapse upon itself, and
this would crush even the hard plastic shells of fast, high-capacity iMacs."
- Minneapolis Star Tribune 10.19.99
Stefan Huy
2000-06-09 11:14:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marc De Scheemaecker
When installing Mac OS X DP3 over Mac OS X Server, I simply booted LinuxPPC
and used the pdisk utility.
Fortunately there's also a pdisk for MacOS. Quite useful (ugly, though).

Will I run into any problems when installing MacOS9, MOSXS1.2 and DP4
onto one HD (3 HFS partitions)? DP2 killed the MOSXS booter, I haven't
tried it with DP3.

Best
-Stefan
Mike Ferris
2000-06-09 17:01:44 UTC
Permalink
You do not need to subclass for this.

If you set an object as the NSTextView's delegate, you can implement the
-textDidChange: delegate method. This will be called whenever the text changes
due to user actions.

You can also implement -textView:shouldChangeTextInRange:replacementString: if
you need control over whether to allow the change to happen.

Mike
Date: Wed, 7 Jun 2000 08:07:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: NSTextView 2
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0c -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment: To unsubscribe, follow directions at
http://www.omnigroup.com/MailArchive/
Hi,
I have got a problem with NSTextView. I need to get a message every time
user write a char into it. Should I subclass NSTextView or is there any
other simpler way?
--
Robert Cerny
**************************
Robert Cerny
DataLine Technology Ltd.
Ceskomoravska 15
190 00 Prague 9
Czech Republic
http://www.dlt.cz
ICQ: 24277867
PGP public keyID: 0x869BE348
Peter Bierman
2000-06-09 22:11:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stefan Huy
Post by Marc De Scheemaecker
When installing Mac OS X DP3 over Mac OS X Server, I simply booted LinuxPPC
and used the pdisk utility.
Fortunately there's also a pdisk for MacOS. Quite useful (ugly, though).
Will I run into any problems when installing MacOS9, MOSXS1.2 and DP4
onto one HD (3 HFS partitions)? DP2 killed the MOSXS booter, I haven't
tried it with DP3.
It should work. Order the partitions:

Mac OS 9
Mac OS X DP4
Mac OS X Server

The DP4 partition needs to be before the server partition if you have an
OldWorld machine.

-pmb

--
"Apple is doomed. At some point the universe may collapse upon itself, and
this would crush even the hard plastic shells of fast, high-capacity iMacs."
- Minneapolis Star Tribune 10.19.99
Glenn Carnagey
2000-06-09 23:10:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Bierman
Post by Stefan Huy
Post by Marc De Scheemaecker
When installing Mac OS X DP3 over Mac OS X Server, I simply booted LinuxPPC
and used the pdisk utility.
Fortunately there's also a pdisk for MacOS. Quite useful (ugly, though).
Will I run into any problems when installing MacOS9, MOSXS1.2 and DP4
onto one HD (3 HFS partitions)? DP2 killed the MOSXS booter, I haven't
tried it with DP3.
Mac OS 9
Mac OS X DP4
Mac OS X Server
The DP4 partition needs to be before the server partition if you have an
OldWorld machine.
Does the chronological order of installation between DP4 and Server
matter here? (just got a new drive 30G for a beige G3 266 MT AV, 1st
part.'s already OS 9, but that's all I've installed so far.)

I'll also have to install WO 4.01 on Server again, this time on the
new Server 1.2 installation, any lookouts there?

pax ex machina,
***@carnagey.com
Scott Anguish
2000-06-10 01:03:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Glenn Carnagey
I'll also have to install WO 4.01 on Server again, this time on the
new Server 1.2 installation, any lookouts there?
Yes.. make sure that you do the full developer .mpkg post install that
is on the 1.2 CD after you install WOF 4.0.1

This is often missed, and then you have dyld issues popping up.
--
Scott Anguish
Stepwise - http://www.stepwise.com
Scott Anguish
2000-06-10 01:03:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Glenn Carnagey
I'll also have to install WO 4.01 on Server again, this time on the
new Server 1.2 installation, any lookouts there?
Yes.. make sure that you do the full developer .mpkg post install that
is on the 1.2 CD after you install WOF 4.0.1

This is often missed, and then you have dyld issues popping up.
--
Scott Anguish
Stepwise - http://www.stepwise.com
Glenn Carnagey
2000-06-09 23:10:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Bierman
Post by Stefan Huy
Post by Marc De Scheemaecker
When installing Mac OS X DP3 over Mac OS X Server, I simply booted LinuxPPC
and used the pdisk utility.
Fortunately there's also a pdisk for MacOS. Quite useful (ugly, though).
Will I run into any problems when installing MacOS9, MOSXS1.2 and DP4
onto one HD (3 HFS partitions)? DP2 killed the MOSXS booter, I haven't
tried it with DP3.
Mac OS 9
Mac OS X DP4
Mac OS X Server
The DP4 partition needs to be before the server partition if you have an
OldWorld machine.
Does the chronological order of installation between DP4 and Server
matter here? (just got a new drive 30G for a beige G3 266 MT AV, 1st
part.'s already OS 9, but that's all I've installed so far.)

I'll also have to install WO 4.01 on Server again, this time on the
new Server 1.2 installation, any lookouts there?

pax ex machina,
***@carnagey.com
Peter Bierman
2000-06-09 23:27:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Glenn Carnagey
Post by Peter Bierman
Post by Stefan Huy
Will I run into any problems when installing MacOS9, MOSXS1.2 and DP4
onto one HD (3 HFS partitions)? DP2 killed the MOSXS booter, I haven't
tried it with DP3.
Mac OS 9
Mac OS X DP4
Mac OS X Server
The DP4 partition needs to be before the server partition if you have an
OldWorld machine.
Does the chronological order of installation between DP4 and Server
matter here? (just got a new drive 30G for a beige G3 266 MT AV, 1st
part.'s already OS 9, but that's all I've installed so far.)
No, but both installs of Mac OS X need to be below the 8GB boundry if
you're installing onto an ATA disk in an OldWorld machine. (You have an
OldWorld machine, but I don't know what kind of disk it is.)

(You can get away with having just the first gig of the filesystem live
under the 8GB boundry, but some future upgrade on that volume might move
the kernel out past the 8GB boundry, and then your install wouldn't boot.
That might be an acceptable risk for you with your current hardware and OS
versions. Lurkers should note that this is only a limitation for OldWorld
machines with ATA disks.)

In your case, you might want to make Mac OS 9 the last volume, not the
first, because holding down 'option' on your machine will cause 9 to boot
no matter where it is.
Post by Glenn Carnagey
I'll also have to install WO 4.01 on Server again, this time on the
new Server 1.2 installation, any lookouts there?
Not that I know of.

-pmb

--
"Apple is doomed. At some point the universe may collapse upon itself, and
this would crush even the hard plastic shells of fast, high-capacity iMacs."
- Minneapolis Star Tribune 10.19.99
Glenn Carnagey
2000-06-10 19:20:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Glenn Carnagey
Post by Peter Bierman
Post by Stefan Huy
Will I run into any problems when installing MacOS9, MOSXS1.2 and DP4
onto one HD (3 HFS partitions)? DP2 killed the MOSXS booter, I haven't
tried it with DP3.
Mac OS 9
Mac OS X DP4
Mac OS X Server
The DP4 partition needs to be before the server partition if you have an
OldWorld machine.
Does the chronological order of installation between DP4 and Server
matter here? (just got a new drive 30G for a beige G3 266 MT AV, 1st
part.'s already OS 9, but that's all I've installed so far.)
No, but both installs of Mac OS X need to be below the 8GB boundary if
you're installing onto an ATA disk in an OldWorld machine. (You have an
OldWorld machine, but I don't know what kind of disk it is.)
Thanks Peter. It's a Maxtor DiamondMax ATA 30GB, partitions are
2.5, 2, 3, 10, 11.5 (all in GB). So the first three are fully in the
8GB limit, due to comments I read here. I have an external 2GB SCSI
that I'll use for messing around with Darwin (I hope ;-).
(You can get away with having just the first gig of the filesystem live
under the 8GB boundry, but some future upgrade on that volume might move
the kernel out past the 8GB boundry, and then your install wouldn't boot.
That might be an acceptable risk for you with your current hardware and OS
versions. Lurkers should note that this is only a limitation for OldWorld
machines with ATA disks.)
In your case, you might want to make Mac OS 9 the last volume, not the
first, because holding down 'option' on your machine will cause 9 to boot
no matter where it is.
Good point. So I'm going to try the order

Mac OS X DP4 (installed third)
Mac OS X Server 1.2 (installed second)
Mac OS 9 (installed first)

You'll hear from me if it doesn't work. ;-) But the one advantage
of no slave IDE abilities is the easy backup on the old disk when you
replace it...
Post by Glenn Carnagey
I'll also have to install WO 4.01 on Server again, this time on the
new Server 1.2 installation, any lookouts there?
Yes.. make sure that you do the full developer .mpkg post install that
is on the 1.2 CD after you install WOF 4.0.1
This is often missed, and then you have dyld issues popping up.
Got it. Thanks, Scott. Would this also be the case if I upgrade it
to WOF 4.5 down the road a little?


pax ex machina,
***@carnagey.com
Glenn Carnagey
2000-06-10 19:20:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Glenn Carnagey
Post by Peter Bierman
Post by Stefan Huy
Will I run into any problems when installing MacOS9, MOSXS1.2 and DP4
onto one HD (3 HFS partitions)? DP2 killed the MOSXS booter, I haven't
tried it with DP3.
Mac OS 9
Mac OS X DP4
Mac OS X Server
The DP4 partition needs to be before the server partition if you have an
OldWorld machine.
Does the chronological order of installation between DP4 and Server
matter here? (just got a new drive 30G for a beige G3 266 MT AV, 1st
part.'s already OS 9, but that's all I've installed so far.)
No, but both installs of Mac OS X need to be below the 8GB boundary if
you're installing onto an ATA disk in an OldWorld machine. (You have an
OldWorld machine, but I don't know what kind of disk it is.)
Thanks Peter. It's a Maxtor DiamondMax ATA 30GB, partitions are
2.5, 2, 3, 10, 11.5 (all in GB). So the first three are fully in the
8GB limit, due to comments I read here. I have an external 2GB SCSI
that I'll use for messing around with Darwin (I hope ;-).
(You can get away with having just the first gig of the filesystem live
under the 8GB boundry, but some future upgrade on that volume might move
the kernel out past the 8GB boundry, and then your install wouldn't boot.
That might be an acceptable risk for you with your current hardware and OS
versions. Lurkers should note that this is only a limitation for OldWorld
machines with ATA disks.)
In your case, you might want to make Mac OS 9 the last volume, not the
first, because holding down 'option' on your machine will cause 9 to boot
no matter where it is.
Good point. So I'm going to try the order

Mac OS X DP4 (installed third)
Mac OS X Server 1.2 (installed second)
Mac OS 9 (installed first)

You'll hear from me if it doesn't work. ;-) But the one advantage
of no slave IDE abilities is the easy backup on the old disk when you
replace it...
Post by Glenn Carnagey
I'll also have to install WO 4.01 on Server again, this time on the
new Server 1.2 installation, any lookouts there?
Yes.. make sure that you do the full developer .mpkg post install that
is on the 1.2 CD after you install WOF 4.0.1
This is often missed, and then you have dyld issues popping up.
Got it. Thanks, Scott. Would this also be the case if I upgrade it
to WOF 4.5 down the road a little?


pax ex machina,
***@carnagey.com
Stefan Huy
2000-06-10 07:41:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Bierman
Mac OS 9
Mac OS X DP4
Mac OS X Server
The DP4 partition needs to be before the server partition if you have an
OldWorld machine.
Will
Post by Peter Bierman
Mac OS 9
Mac OS X Server
Mac OS X DP4
work on a G4 (sawtooth) ? (I already have Server installed :)

And what can I do if the bootloader suddenly displays the broken Icon
(#!@$) after installing OS9 in front of an already installed DP4 on my
Wallstreet (Partition 1: OS9, Part 2: DP4. DP4 bootet once after the OS 9
installation).

Best
-Stefan

__Stefan Huy___________________________________________________________
____
______ mailto:***@stud.uni-hannover.de
________ http://www.stud.uni-hannover.de/~huy
______________________________________________________________________
Peter Bierman
2000-06-12 05:03:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stefan Huy
Will
Post by Peter Bierman
Mac OS 9
Mac OS X Server
Mac OS X DP4
work on a G4 (sawtooth) ? (I already have Server installed :)
It should.
Post by Stefan Huy
And what can I do if the bootloader suddenly displays the broken Icon
Wallstreet (Partition 1: OS9, Part 2: DP4. DP4 bootet once after the OS 9
installation).
I dunno.
Are you using System Disk 3.x to make the DP4 volume the startup disk?

-pmb

--
"Apple is doomed. At some point the universe may collapse upon itself, and
this would crush even the hard plastic shells of fast, high-capacity iMacs."
- Minneapolis Star Tribune 10.19.99
Molly Reed
2000-06-13 22:42:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Bierman
Post by Stefan Huy
And what can I do if the bootloader suddenly displays the broken Icon
Wallstreet (Partition 1: OS9, Part 2: DP4. DP4 bootet once after
the OS 9
Post by Peter Bierman
Post by Stefan Huy
installation).
I dunno.
Are you using System Disk 3.x to make the DP4 volume the startup disk?
It's working again. I left it alone over the weekend, I guess it just
wasn't in the right mood... ("the mood to boot": an often underestimated
sign of good will of your processor-driven devices)

Best
-Stefan

__Stefan Huy___________________________________________________________
____
______ mailto:***@stud.uni-hannover.de
________ http://www.stud.uni-hannover.de/~huy
______________________________________________________________________




----------------- End Forwarded Message -----------------

__Stefan Huy___________________________________________________________
____
______ mailto:***@stud.uni-hannover.de
________ http://www.stud.uni-hannover.de/~huy
______________________________________________________________________
Robert Cerny
2000-06-07 14:50:29 UTC
Permalink
Hi,
I have got a problem with NSTextView. I need to get a message every time
user write a char into it. Should I subclass NSTextView or is there any
other simpler way?
--
Robert Cerny
**************************
Robert Cerny
DataLine Technology Ltd.
Ceskomoravska 15
190 00 Prague 9
Czech Republic
mailto:***@dlt.cz
http://www.dlt.cz
ICQ: 24277867
PGP public keyID: 0x869BE348
Mark F. Murphy
2000-06-07 15:11:41 UTC
Permalink
I sent email to "***@seeding.apple.com" asking if there was a
list to discuess DP4 issues where one would not violate their seeding
license.

So far, no response.

Do I not have the correct email address?

In fact, I didn't see any email lists on the ADC member site.

mark
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark F. Murphy, Director Software Development <mailto:***@tyrell.com>
Tyrell Software Corp <http://www.tyrell.com>
PowerPerl(tm), Add Power To Your Webpage! <http://www.powerperl.com>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Families Against Internet Censorship: http://home.rmi.net/~fagin/faic/
Wade Williams
2000-06-07 19:46:47 UTC
Permalink
I got a reply back from ADC. No such lists exist.

Wade

-----Original Message-----
From: macosx-***@omnigroup.com [mailto:macosx-***@omnigroup.com]On
Behalf Of Mark F. Murphy
Sent: Wednesday, June 07, 2000 11:11 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list
Subject: List To Discuss DP4 Issues



I sent email to "***@seeding.apple.com" asking if there was a
list to discuess DP4 issues where one would not violate their seeding
license.

So far, no response.

Do I not have the correct email address?

In fact, I didn't see any email lists on the ADC member site.

mark
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark F. Murphy, Director Software Development <mailto:***@tyrell.com>
Tyrell Software Corp <http://www.tyrell.com>
PowerPerl(tm), Add Power To Your Webpage! <http://www.powerperl.com>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Families Against Internet Censorship: http://home.rmi.net/~fagin/faic/
Elliot Silver
2000-06-07 20:19:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Young
what is the := operator symbol typically used for?
I've generally (only?) seen it used for assignment.

If I recall correctly this is what Pascal (and from that I would assume
Modula and Oberon) uses, and Smalltalk also accepts it (Smalltalk originally
used left arrow for assignment and up arrow for return; at some point they
realised that these characters weren't always present so they also accept :=
and ^ for these items).


Elliot.
__________________________________________________________________
Elliot Silver, Software Developer ***@alitech.com
A.L.I. Technologies Inc. tel: (604) 279-5422 x376
130 - 10711 Cambie Road fax: (604) 279-5468
Richmond, BC, CANADA www.alitech.com
Peter Bierman
2000-06-08 04:10:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jason M. Smith
So, question is: does the reformat performed blow away the
*entire* disk, or *just* the partition selected? You'd think the
If you use Drive Setup, it does the whole disk.

If you use the DP4 installer, and check the "reformat" checkbox, then it
does just the volume you have selected.
Post by Jason M. Smith
Yeah, yeah, "thou shalt back up before installing new software..."
Almost every time someone's come to me and said "it nuked the wrong disk!",
it was because they picked the wrong disk themselves, and weren't paying
attention when the installer asked them if they really wanted to erase it.

Do that backup. It's a developer preview. It might eat your disks next
week, not just during installation. (And if it does, please let us know...)

-pmb

--
"Apple is doomed. At some point the universe may collapse upon itself, and
this would crush even the hard plastic shells of fast, high-capacity iMacs."
- Minneapolis Star Tribune 10.19.99
Eric Peyton
2000-06-08 20:42:42 UTC
Permalink
What issues can't you talk about here? Scott already mentioned that
development issues are a go as long as they are code based. This isn't
the right place to talk about the user interface of the operating
system. Basically if you can find a reference to it on the apple
public web pages it should be okay to discuss here (I beleive).

If you want to ask ... I was coding X on DP4 and Y happened, am I doing X
correct? - I would think that is very valid.

If you want to discuss things related to the OS UI, it doesn't belong here
anyway ...

What exactly can't people talk about on this development list that they
wish they could?

Eric


On Thu, 8 Jun
Post by Mark F. Murphy
Post by Wade Williams
I got a reply back from ADC. No such lists exist.
Hmmmm... sounds like there needs to be an *underground* list where
the list owners do not care DP4 is being discussed and where posters
are anonymous to Apple doesn't go after their seeding license.
Not being able to talk about DP4 issues with fellow developers is not fun.
mark
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tyrell Software Corp <http://www.tyrell.com>
PowerPerl(tm), Add Power To Your Webpage! <http://www.powerperl.com>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Families Against Internet Censorship: http://home.rmi.net/~fagin/faic/
Eric Peyton
***@epicware.com

Software and Source for Mac OS X
Marc De Scheemaecker
2000-06-08 22:14:43 UTC
Permalink
When installing Mac OS X DP3 over Mac OS X Server, I simply booted LinuxPPC
and used the pdisk utility.
I deleted the partitions (three of them) belonging to Mac OS X Server and
created a new HFS partition.
I booted then in Mac OS and used Silverlining Pro to reformat the partition
(for some reason, Special/Erase Disk didn't work) and I had a fresh
partition to install Mac OS X on.

PS: After you install Mac OS X, the partition becomes a little bit smaller
as two hidden partitions are created. One small HFS (type "Apple_Boot", name
"MOSX_OF3_Booter") that contains the OpenFirmware boot script and the first
stage boot loader.
A second partition(type "Apple_Loader", name "SecondaryLoader") contains the
second stage boot loader.
I guess if you simply "reuse" the MacOS X DP3 partition, you waste 8.5 MB
and two entries in the partition table.

PPS: - You can find information about the boot process on www.linuxppc.org.
- The process is pretty advanced, so don't blame me if something goes
wrong. Backups sometimes have their use ;-)
Post by Jason M. Smith
I want to install DP4 over DP3 on my development machine.
1) MacOS 8.6 (soon to be bumped to 9) (HFS+)
2) DP3 (HFS+)
Docs indicate that I should format the disk with DP3 to
install DP4, and tells how to go about doing that. Fine enough, I
did that on another machine already (yes, two licenses, thanks... :)
). That one was DP3 only, however.
Peter Bierman
2000-06-09 00:39:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marc De Scheemaecker
When installing Mac OS X DP3 over Mac OS X Server, I simply booted LinuxPPC
and used the pdisk utility.
I deleted the partitions (three of them) belonging to Mac OS X Server and
created a new HFS partition.
I booted then in Mac OS and used Silverlining Pro to reformat the partition
(for some reason, Special/Erase Disk didn't work) and I had a fresh
partition to install Mac OS X on.
That's definately the cleanest way to do it.
Post by Marc De Scheemaecker
I guess if you simply "reuse" the MacOS X DP3 partition, you waste 8.5 MB
and two entries in the partition table.
DP4 will reuse the DP3 booter and loader partitions if you install over
DP3, wasting nothing. :-)
Post by Marc De Scheemaecker
PS: After you install Mac OS X, the partition becomes a little bit smaller
as two hidden partitions are created. One small HFS (type "Apple_Boot", name
"MOSX_OF3_Booter") that contains the OpenFirmware boot script and the first
stage boot loader.
A second partition(type "Apple_Loader", name "SecondaryLoader") contains the
second stage boot loader.
Actually, the Booter is for NewWorld machines, and the Loader is for
OldWorld machines. And both partitions will eventually be unneeded for HFS+
installs.

-pmb

--
"Apple is doomed. At some point the universe may collapse upon itself, and
this would crush even the hard plastic shells of fast, high-capacity iMacs."
- Minneapolis Star Tribune 10.19.99
Stefan Huy
2000-06-09 11:14:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marc De Scheemaecker
When installing Mac OS X DP3 over Mac OS X Server, I simply booted LinuxPPC
and used the pdisk utility.
Fortunately there's also a pdisk for MacOS. Quite useful (ugly, though).

Will I run into any problems when installing MacOS9, MOSXS1.2 and DP4
onto one HD (3 HFS partitions)? DP2 killed the MOSXS booter, I haven't
tried it with DP3.

Best
-Stefan
Mike Ferris
2000-06-09 17:01:44 UTC
Permalink
You do not need to subclass for this.

If you set an object as the NSTextView's delegate, you can implement the
-textDidChange: delegate method. This will be called whenever the text changes
due to user actions.

You can also implement -textView:shouldChangeTextInRange:replacementString: if
you need control over whether to allow the change to happen.

Mike
Date: Wed, 7 Jun 2000 08:07:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: NSTextView 2
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0c -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment: To unsubscribe, follow directions at
http://www.omnigroup.com/MailArchive/
Hi,
I have got a problem with NSTextView. I need to get a message every time
user write a char into it. Should I subclass NSTextView or is there any
other simpler way?
--
Robert Cerny
**************************
Robert Cerny
DataLine Technology Ltd.
Ceskomoravska 15
190 00 Prague 9
Czech Republic
http://www.dlt.cz
ICQ: 24277867
PGP public keyID: 0x869BE348
Peter Bierman
2000-06-09 22:11:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stefan Huy
Post by Marc De Scheemaecker
When installing Mac OS X DP3 over Mac OS X Server, I simply booted LinuxPPC
and used the pdisk utility.
Fortunately there's also a pdisk for MacOS. Quite useful (ugly, though).
Will I run into any problems when installing MacOS9, MOSXS1.2 and DP4
onto one HD (3 HFS partitions)? DP2 killed the MOSXS booter, I haven't
tried it with DP3.
It should work. Order the partitions:

Mac OS 9
Mac OS X DP4
Mac OS X Server

The DP4 partition needs to be before the server partition if you have an
OldWorld machine.

-pmb

--
"Apple is doomed. At some point the universe may collapse upon itself, and
this would crush even the hard plastic shells of fast, high-capacity iMacs."
- Minneapolis Star Tribune 10.19.99
Peter Bierman
2000-06-09 23:27:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Glenn Carnagey
Post by Peter Bierman
Post by Stefan Huy
Will I run into any problems when installing MacOS9, MOSXS1.2 and DP4
onto one HD (3 HFS partitions)? DP2 killed the MOSXS booter, I haven't
tried it with DP3.
Mac OS 9
Mac OS X DP4
Mac OS X Server
The DP4 partition needs to be before the server partition if you have an
OldWorld machine.
Does the chronological order of installation between DP4 and Server
matter here? (just got a new drive 30G for a beige G3 266 MT AV, 1st
part.'s already OS 9, but that's all I've installed so far.)
No, but both installs of Mac OS X need to be below the 8GB boundry if
you're installing onto an ATA disk in an OldWorld machine. (You have an
OldWorld machine, but I don't know what kind of disk it is.)

(You can get away with having just the first gig of the filesystem live
under the 8GB boundry, but some future upgrade on that volume might move
the kernel out past the 8GB boundry, and then your install wouldn't boot.
That might be an acceptable risk for you with your current hardware and OS
versions. Lurkers should note that this is only a limitation for OldWorld
machines with ATA disks.)

In your case, you might want to make Mac OS 9 the last volume, not the
first, because holding down 'option' on your machine will cause 9 to boot
no matter where it is.
Post by Glenn Carnagey
I'll also have to install WO 4.01 on Server again, this time on the
new Server 1.2 installation, any lookouts there?
Not that I know of.

-pmb

--
"Apple is doomed. At some point the universe may collapse upon itself, and
this would crush even the hard plastic shells of fast, high-capacity iMacs."
- Minneapolis Star Tribune 10.19.99
Stefan Huy
2000-06-10 07:41:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Bierman
Mac OS 9
Mac OS X DP4
Mac OS X Server
The DP4 partition needs to be before the server partition if you have an
OldWorld machine.
Will
Post by Peter Bierman
Mac OS 9
Mac OS X Server
Mac OS X DP4
work on a G4 (sawtooth) ? (I already have Server installed :)

And what can I do if the bootloader suddenly displays the broken Icon
(#!@$) after installing OS9 in front of an already installed DP4 on my
Wallstreet (Partition 1: OS9, Part 2: DP4. DP4 bootet once after the OS 9
installation).

Best
-Stefan

__Stefan Huy___________________________________________________________
____
______ mailto:***@stud.uni-hannover.de
________ http://www.stud.uni-hannover.de/~huy
______________________________________________________________________
Peter Bierman
2000-06-12 05:03:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stefan Huy
Will
Post by Peter Bierman
Mac OS 9
Mac OS X Server
Mac OS X DP4
work on a G4 (sawtooth) ? (I already have Server installed :)
It should.
Post by Stefan Huy
And what can I do if the bootloader suddenly displays the broken Icon
Wallstreet (Partition 1: OS9, Part 2: DP4. DP4 bootet once after the OS 9
installation).
I dunno.
Are you using System Disk 3.x to make the DP4 volume the startup disk?

-pmb

--
"Apple is doomed. At some point the universe may collapse upon itself, and
this would crush even the hard plastic shells of fast, high-capacity iMacs."
- Minneapolis Star Tribune 10.19.99
Molly Reed
2000-06-13 22:42:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Bierman
Post by Stefan Huy
And what can I do if the bootloader suddenly displays the broken Icon
Wallstreet (Partition 1: OS9, Part 2: DP4. DP4 bootet once after
the OS 9
Post by Peter Bierman
Post by Stefan Huy
installation).
I dunno.
Are you using System Disk 3.x to make the DP4 volume the startup disk?
It's working again. I left it alone over the weekend, I guess it just
wasn't in the right mood... ("the mood to boot": an often underestimated
sign of good will of your processor-driven devices)

Best
-Stefan

__Stefan Huy___________________________________________________________
____
______ mailto:***@stud.uni-hannover.de
________ http://www.stud.uni-hannover.de/~huy
______________________________________________________________________




----------------- End Forwarded Message -----------------

__Stefan Huy___________________________________________________________
____
______ mailto:***@stud.uni-hannover.de
________ http://www.stud.uni-hannover.de/~huy
______________________________________________________________________
Continue reading on narkive:
Loading...